Late

Exactly.

yeah, i read that message too

Ala french xp

but it was there just for secs

so... i'm having some clue there

cuz the message when I've got Miui they are still appearing with that message

Lost all my history

Ask them (Facebook/Whatsapp or NSA), sure they have a copy.

this weekend I'm going to unearth the other nexus and going to test a thing...

Both sides claim they worked together to implement Signal's encryption algorithm into WhatsApp. And while I personally kinda trust OpenWhisperSystems (the developers of Signal) not to lie about this, good security isn't based on trust but on proof. Besides, after the successful collaboration, Facebook could've just removed the secure encryption by OpenWhisperSystems or added some code to it so that a master Facebook key can decrypt all messages also. Don't forget that they (Facebook) can program too and it's easy for them to change everything OpenWhisperSystems implemented.

They can do whatever they want to and we can't know for sure because we can't access the code.

Ask them (Facebook/Whatsapp or NSA), sure they have a copy.

Ha ha ha ha

Both sides claim they worked together to implement Signal's encryption algorithm into WhatsApp. And while I personally kinda trust OpenWhisperSystems (the developers of Signal) not to lie about this, good security isn't based on trust but on proof. Besides, after the successful collaboration, Facebook could've just removed the secure encryption by OpenWhisperSystems or added some code to it so that a master Facebook key can decrypt all messages also. Don't forget that they (Facebook) can program too and it's easy for them to change everything OpenWhisperSystems implemented.

After the successful collaboration, Facebook added end to end encryption to Facebook messenger

[proof needed]

Ask them (Facebook/Whatsapp or NSA), sure they have a copy.

Nah, Facebook won't waste server space saving copies of billions of users. But the NSA surely does! Ask them!

After the successful collaboration, Facebook added end to end encryption to Facebook messenger

Sounds like marketing to me.

[proof needed]

https://www.google.fr/amp/newsroom.fb.com/news/2016/07/messenger-starts-testing-end-to-end-encryption-with-secret-conversations/amp/

Sounds like marketing to me.

Of course it is

https://www.google.fr/amp/newsroom.fb.com/news/2016/07/messenger-starts-testing-end-to-end-encryption-with-secret-conversations/amp/

Claim ≠ proof

Exactly.

I can claim that I have a working time machine as well. Buuuut...

Meanwhile, I'm here on kitkat 4.4.2 ?

It could be worse, it could be a phone with Ice-cream Sandwich

You can see them

Where?

Claim ≠ proof

Lmao

Where?

Go to one of your contacts profile, select encryption

There come the codes

And how do I know Facebook doesn't have any access to it?

https://www.google.fr/amp/newsroom.fb.com/news/2016/07/messenger-starts-testing-end-to-end-encryption-with-secret-conversations/amp/

Talk is cheap, show me the code!

T

And how do I know Facebook doesn't have any access to it?

One thing you can be sure of : Telegram can see your messages.

Exist a secret chat option.

And the client is open. Shame it's impossible to say the same about the server.

Welcome here @Ukalakaziuk

T

?

There come the codes

It's just a picture and some numbers, possibly a checksum. They could be showing random numbers and you wouldn't know.

Thanks Lesik You just wrote what I wanted to say. But faster and better.

?

?

Sorry...

Is that a Signal or Whatsapp screenshot?

Is that a Signal or Whatsapp screenshot?

WhatsApp

Anxhelo was talking about WhatsApp.

Ok

Well I have nothing more to say about that

May you think the whole world is a conspiracy

Exist a secret chat option.

That people use when they want to share their credit card pin

Come on it's not serious here

We're talking about people using apps to talk to their mom on an daily basis

Come on it's not serious here

Obviously WhatsApp is taking it serious, right?

May you think the whole world is a conspiracy

Conspiracy? Facebook makes money with your data, that's a fact. Some simple logic might tell you that they wouldn't want to shoot themselves in the foot with encryption.

Conspiracy? Facebook makes money with your data, that's a fact. Some simple logic might tell you that they wouldn't want to shoot themselves in the foot with encryption.

Yes, they do. Because they do know that someday encryption will be mandatory.

And they want people to use their products.

With their market share they wouldn't loose anything even if they didn't follow the trend.

Average Joe doesn't care about encryption

What about Google's market share? They are the first on encryption technologies

Average Joe won't quit WhatsApp because of that

What about Google's market share? They are the first on encryption technologies

Because their market share in messaging is laughably low. They try to innovate because they have the need for it.

Facebook is basically a monopoly and it's going to stay like that for a while

Because their market share in messaging is laughably low. They try to innovate because they have the need for it.

No they don't. People would use Google photos or Google Drive even if it's not https.

Because "average Joe" doesn't care

You misunderstood my message. They need to innovate to gain more users. One of their ideas is encryption. Whether or not their ideas are effective you can see by their market share in the corresponding sector.

I think the same idea applies to Facebook

Also, if they didn't HTTPS we'd have tons of intercepted credentials and that would kill Google.

I think the same idea applies to Facebook

They have an enormous market share. They don't need to innovate, yet.

Look how they "invented" voice messages years after other chat programs had it.

Well, I'm going to bed right now. Good talking to you all.

Look how you can send pdf files now, years after you could send any file <1,5GB on Telegram.

ERROR: S client not available

The initial discussion was about "Whatsapp is bad, switch to telegram"

No it was not.

My point : Telegram doesn't offer default e2e encryption and is focused right now to host jihadists. You don't have worse for a privacy focused messaging app, imo

The topic was "WhatsApp is bad, Telegram isn't good either, let's have a technical discussion about up- and downsides." Then for an hour or so you chose to ignore the downsides of WhatsApp that we discussed.

The topic was "WhatsApp is bad, Telegram isn't good either, let's have a technical discussion about up- and downsides." Then for an hour or so you chose to ignore the downsides of WhatsApp that we discussed.

^^^

The topic was "WhatsApp is bad, Telegram isn't good either, let's have a technical discussion about up- and downsides." Then for an hour or so you chose to ignore the downsides of WhatsApp that we discussed.

No, I just ignore the fact that "Whatsapp isn't open-source so you can't verify the encryption". I did admit that backup shit was wrong.

My point : Telegram doesn't offer default e2e encryption and is focused right now to host jihadists. You don't have worse for a privacy focused messaging app, imo

And that's where you're wrong, because there's WhatsApp, Viber, Facebook Messenger and others that offer no real (that means proven) encryption at all.

No, I just ignore the fact that "Whatsapp isn't open-source so you can't verify the encryption". I did admit that backup shit was wrong.

So you chose to ignore the truth? If I told you I give you a free computer, it's totally not keylogged, do all your online banking on it. Also I have a large criminal record. Would you use that computer?

My point was that, before Whatsapp, people used texts that weren't encrypted at all.

My point was that, before Whatsapp, people used texts that weren't encrypted at all.

And they still aren't.

Except if you're talking about client-to-server. Then that's a small progress, I admit.

And they still aren't.

We can prove that they are, in transit at least.

We can prove that they are, in transit at least.

Yes, it's client-to-server that can be proven.

You are right.

And you are right about your computer, that I won't use.

I guess it's better if Facebook can read your messages instead of any criminal that intercepts your SMS traffic.

I guess it's better if Facebook can read your messages instead of any criminal that intercepts your SMS traffic.

Well

AT&T could intercept your SMS traffic.

We're not talking about any criminal here.

Anybody could intercept your traffic if they're knowledgeable.

A smart criminal with a degree in c.s. for example.

Could you please recap Lesik your solution for everyday messaging for non tech people

I'm not saying I have a solution, I'm saying it's delusional to believe that chatting over WhatsApp is safe. Remember, we're having a technical discussion here, not a "what messenger is best?".

I'm not saying I have a solution, I'm saying it's delusional to believe that chatting over WhatsApp is safe. Remember, we're having a technical discussion here, not a "what messenger is best?".

That's the discussion I engaged in ;)

The discussion was about Telegram vs. Whatsapp. As of today, I don't see any other messaging app for everyday people, with some compromises, than Whatsapp

What, did u just delete your 2 messages?

Can you do that?

I can't see it anymore

Yes, it's a supergroup. You can delete them here.

Wow, OK, great

The discussion was about Telegram vs. Whatsapp. As of today, I don't see any other messaging app for everyday people, with some compromises, than Whatsapp

Umm, I don't think that was the topic of discussion and I'm pretty sure others will agree... How can you think we're talking about Telegram vs WhatsApp when we clearly talked about XMPP, PGP, OTR, PFS and so on? I think it was quite obvious neither WhatsApp nor Telegram was the main topic here, but secure communication in general. And then you came and delusionally stated that WhatsApp can be trusted. None of us say that Telegram is Nr. 1 and the go-to messenger for everybody. We're having a technical discussion, talking about pros and cons of each messenger, and messaging/encryption theory in general. A downside of WhatsApp was the lack of encryption. Never was this a discussion solely about WhatsApp.