What's the tool to create such images?

i think archiso can create other distro iso as well

yeah, i all of the time just put the bootonly iso on ventoy usb

Handbook is still talking about iso -> optical. Ventoy is a hack and don't work on every iso

Handbook is still talking about iso -> optical. Ventoy is a hack and don't work on every iso

hmmm, what iso it doesn't work on?

also ventoy is a cool hack, most linux distros give an iso file and tell you to flash it on usb while ventoy removes that cumbersome pain

also ventoy is a cool hack, most linux distros give an iso file and tell you to flash it on usb while ventoy removes that cumbersome pain

Don't rely on it. Not every OS will work

Don't rely on it. Not every OS will work

i mean unless something is even more nicher then templeos and freebsd and very different then unix or windows systems, sure but idk if anyone uses any os like that ¯\_ (ツ) _/¯

i mean unless something is even more nicher then templeos and freebsd and very different then unix or windows systems, sure but idk if anyone uses any os like that ¯\_ (ツ) _/¯

Still. A hack. Doesn't work on all ISOs

Still. A hack. Doesn't work on all ISOs

there is nothing that works in all the cases even windows doesn't work on all the hardware so you can't say windows sucks and is a hack because it doesn't work on very niche hardware, get a valid argument and anyways https://www.ventoy.net/en/isolist.html

there is nothing that works in all the cases even windows doesn't work on all the hardware so you can't say windows sucks and is a hack because it doesn't work on very niche hardware, get a valid argument and anyways https://www.ventoy.net/en/isolist.html

I don't say it suck. I say you can't relay on every iso. Basically it tested with windows Linux and some FreeBSD variants.

C is NOT assembly language, but it generates native assembly. And that depends on the implementation of the C compiler and how well it does. But what I was saying is that when people treat C is "it can do everything, so let's write the next desktop environment" in it, then the next "Music app" in it, then you are looking at manual memory management on a large codebase without a significant compiler checks (because C is less opinionated than Rust) and that leads to all sort of possibilities to access footguns

I am not claiming that C is assembly language, I am claiming that C is not portable assembly. its treatment as such is misleading and you can tell that it is because when you do learn assembly you're not thinking "Wow, this is exactly like C!" you're thinking of the compiler and how it translates to it

If it was, then the skill would be transferable

or maybe its just me that isn't plugged in to the matrix and doesn't immediately see the assembly output coming from C code

or maybe its just me that isn't plugged in to the matrix and doesn't immediately see the assembly output coming from C code

It's not just you.C is still a perfect application development language. Not just a system language

I disagree on that, too much UB

i mean unless something is even more nicher then templeos and freebsd and very different then unix or windows systems, sure but idk if anyone uses any os like that ¯\_ (ツ) _/¯

Iirc, i've seen some people have trouble with openbsd iso on ventoy

I don't say it suck. I say you can't relay on every iso. Basically it tested with windows Linux and some FreeBSD variants.

yeah, again, the example of why it is a bad argument stands still

there is nothing that works in all the cases even windows doesn't work on all the hardware so you can't say windows sucks and is a hack because it doesn't work on very niche hardware, get a valid argument and anyways https://www.ventoy.net/en/isolist.html

.

Iirc, i've seen some people have trouble with openbsd iso on ventoy

It's not on the list. Nor netbsd reactos or plan9. Ventoy probably using some Linux bootloader and can boot OSes supported by this loader. Surprise!

Iirc, i've seen some people have trouble with openbsd iso on ventoy

https://github.com/ventoy/Ventoy/issues/2486#issuecomment-2268122823 weird....

It's not just you.C is still a perfect application development language. Not just a system language

C is fine but not perfect, a perfect application language would take into account safety, you wouldn't have to worry unless necessary about the low level and it should still be performant, it should also scale. This isn't a point for rust mind you, I wasn't even thinking of that

Since long time ago

I'll bite. I found no isohybrid in base or ports and no public announcement on ISOs booting from USB. Handbook stills suggest using .iso and .img. Are you referring to FreeNAS maybe?

I'll bite. I found no isohybrid in base or ports and no public announcement on ISOs booting from USB. Handbook stills suggest using .iso and .img. Are you referring to FreeNAS maybe?

can confirm that works even though no announcement 🫠

I'll bite. I found no isohybrid in base or ports and no public announcement on ISOs booting from USB. Handbook stills suggest using .iso and .img. Are you referring to FreeNAS maybe?

Oh, no. I meant I'm not sure how they do that, but it's possible that it's done in macOS/Linux or some other systems

Oh, no. I meant I'm not sure how they do that, but it's possible that it's done in macOS/Linux or some other systems

You think FreBSD release us done on Linux or MacOS? Doubt

I am not claiming that C is assembly language, I am claiming that C is not portable assembly. its treatment as such is misleading and you can tell that it is because when you do learn assembly you're not thinking "Wow, this is exactly like C!" you're thinking of the compiler and how it translates to it

I have no idea what that means

You think FreBSD release us done on Linux or MacOS? Doubt

I don't know

I also don't see what's the problem of doing few specific things in Linux/macOS

can confirm that works even though no announcement 🫠

Interesting. It's a big point I would like to read in the announcement. Can you provide a output of "file FreeBSD.iso"

Interesting. It's a big point I would like to read in the announcement. Can you provide a output of "file FreeBSD.iso"

later, my pc is compiling stuff right now, and it will choke itself if i touch it

I also don't see what's the problem of doing few specific things in Linux/macOS

The project tries to be self-sufficient. I dont think they want to rely on 3rd party operating system to build a release

The project tries to be self-sufficient. I dont think they want to rely on 3rd party operating system to build a release

https://man.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=release&apropos=0&sektion=7&format=html this is how they built i think

https://wiki.freebsd.org/BuildSystems

https://wiki.freebsd.org/BuildSystems

These look like some sort of build scripts. I think it's funny that it's not clear how to generate hybrid ISO

These look like some sort of build scripts. I think it's funny that it's not clear how to generate hybrid ISO

? i expect that the same tool is used to build the bootonly iso which i tested to boot on usb

? i expect that the same tool is used to build the bootonly iso which i tested to boot on usb

Found it. It is mkimg https://reviews-dev.freebsd.org/D15051

Found it. It is mkimg https://reviews-dev.freebsd.org/D15051

cool

Interesting. It's a big point I would like to read in the announcement. Can you provide a output of "file FreeBSD.iso"

FreeBSD-14.1-RELEASE-amd64-bootonly.iso: ISO 9660 CD-ROM filesystem data (DOS/MBR boot sector) '14_1_RELEASE_AMD64_BO' (bootable)

Found it. It is mkimg https://reviews-dev.freebsd.org/D15051

TIL thank you

FreeBSD-14.1-RELEASE-amd64-bootonly.iso: ISO 9660 CD-ROM filesystem data (DOS/MBR boot sector) '14_1_RELEASE_AMD64_BO' (bootable)

Thanks. The boot sector is the crucial part

This is interesting: Ken Thompson’s 1984 Turing Award speech revealed the Ken Thompson Hack (KTH), where a virus was inserted into a C compiler, creating an undetectable backdoor in the login function and also in the compiler itself, making it propagate across systems and tools like debuggers and disassemblers. This hack demonstrated that no binary can be fully trusted, even if compiled from trusted source code, because the tools involved could be compromised. It showed that systems like UNIX, Linux, OSX, and WinXP can never be fully secure, as hidden backdoors could exist. In 2009, a virus exploiting KTH was found in Delphi applications. While countermeasures exist, they are ineffective without a clean compiler, which is nearly impossible to obtain in modern systems compromised by surveillance agencies. Building a secure toolchain requires extreme efforts, like assembling one from TTL logic and handwritten CPU code, though even obfuscating source code may still fail, as the compromised compiler could detect and bypass it https://wiki.c2.com/?TheKenThompsonHack

The creator of the Rust programming language Graydon Hoare says that he's deeply worried about people pushing Rust programming language master race superiority

Thats actually pretty common .. same thing about c++

Thats actually pretty common .. same thing about c++

Yup

Also if a language solves problems by adding new features constantly, that language has a problem with it's fundamental design. A programming language, for example, is initially designed for simple server and desktop software development - so it starts with basic stuff like reading and writing data, performing calculations, and generating simple visualization. But then, over time, language creators start adding the ability to deploy machine learning models; then they add web frameworks; and then they add a game engine inside it. Now the language is virtually complex beyond an unimaginable level, with a steep learning curve. Working with other developers who mix and match tools from one side to another (like using an ML function with web sockets, because they can) finally causes the language to lose focus and go nowhere.

Also if a language solves problems by adding new features constantly, that language has a problem with it's fundamental design. A programming language, for example, is initially designed for simple server and desktop software development - so it starts with basic stuff like reading and writing data, performing calculations, and generating simple visualization. But then, over time, language creators start adding the ability to deploy machine learning models; then they add web frameworks; and then they add a game engine inside it. Now the language is virtually complex beyond an unimaginable level, with a steep learning curve. Working with other developers who mix and match tools from one side to another (like using an ML function with web sockets, because they can) finally causes the language to lose focus and go nowhere.

This reminds me of python's @ operator. It was added ~10 years ago to simplify some linear algebra code, but I haven't seen it used anywhere outside of numpy, not even in the std library, afaik.

This reminds me of python's @ operator. It was added ~10 years ago to simplify some linear algebra code, but I haven't seen it used anywhere outside of numpy, not even in the std library, afaik.

Yes

This reminds me of python's @ operator. It was added ~10 years ago to simplify some linear algebra code, but I haven't seen it used anywhere outside of numpy, not even in the std library, afaik.

do you mean decorators in python?

do you mean decorators in python?

https://docs.python.org/3/whatsnew/3.5.html#pep-465-a-dedicated-infix-operator-for-matrix-multiplication

do you mean decorators in python?

I see

Cant fbsd 14.0 be upgraded to 14.1 after eol? I tried to upgrade to 14.1 by running: freebsd-update fetch, freebsd-update install and then freebsd-update -r 14.1-RELEASE upgrade. When running the upgrade command it said that /var/db/update or something like doesnt exist.

Also running pkg update && pkg upgrade displayed some warning/question.

Google the error

I remember you need to do something like pkg -f something

pkg-static install

Seems your pkg database is out of sync

You should have done the FreeBSD-update steps and then pkg upgrade. Then the FreeBSD-update -r

group, if I run stable compiled locally, do I need to use ports or can I use pkg?

Both i think so

Both i think so

so, I can use pkg, right?

Yes

question to everyone here running 14-Stable, do you have any problem with i915kms lately? I cannot load it, not during boot and not manually. it hangs and I need to hard reset the pc

Did you upgrade?

Did you upgrade?

yes, from source, 14.1-Release to 14-Stable

sounds like a downgrade? or am I missing something?

did it 3 days ago and today, still the same problem if you meant my pkg's, yes, they are up to date

sounds like a downgrade? or am I missing something?

you are missing the branch

ok

ok

well, technically it was to 14.2-Stable to be precise, but 14-Stable is the generic name 😉

question to everyone here running 14-Stable, do you have any problem with i915kms lately? I cannot load it, not during boot and not manually. it hangs and I need to hard reset the pc

it is working now, after I build the graphics/drm-kmod from ports

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upgraded to 14.2 successfully :D

drm-kmod and amdgpu seems to be broken for me?

but thank god for boot environments

upgraded to 14.2 successfully :D

Which gpu driver did you install?

Which gpu driver did you install?

i915kms

WADAFAK

Because of 'ZROOTFS /usr/local' Poudriere BUG submitted here: https://github.com/freebsd/poudriere/issues/1191 I modified my related articles with ZROOTFS=/dev/null for your protection. Articles: https://vermaden.wordpress.com/2023/04/30/simple-freebsd-poudriere-harvester-guide/ https://vermaden.wordpress.com/2023/08/10/freebsd-on-freeipa-idm-with-poudriere-repo/ https://vermaden.wordpress.com/2024/03/06/connect-freebsd-14-0-stable-to-freeipa-idm/ Source: vermaden

Guys, a question; i use fbsd 14.1 on my headless nas, connecting to it via ssh. I am not a big VI fan, but i know the absolut basics, so i have attempted to use it to modify the config files. Maybe i dont know VI well enough, but it is terrible. I navigate to the string i'd like to modify, then i press "i" to switch insert mode, then i press "Del" to delete some characters. In some cases the character right before the one i deleted will somehow become upper case, this is annoying and i dont unddrstand why this happens. An example: if i delete the "S" in the "test" string it becomes "tEt". No idea why. Also it switches seemingly randomly between insert and non-insert mode, so i am never sure, what will happen if i press a key. I always install " mg" to be able to do basic text-editing tasks efficiently. Is "vi" really that bad, or am i doing something wrong? Why does it capitalize the characters?

Guys, a question; i use fbsd 14.1 on my headless nas, connecting to it via ssh. I am not a big VI fan, but i know the absolut basics, so i have attempted to use it to modify the config files. Maybe i dont know VI well enough, but it is terrible. I navigate to the string i'd like to modify, then i press "i" to switch insert mode, then i press "Del" to delete some characters. In some cases the character right before the one i deleted will somehow become upper case, this is annoying and i dont unddrstand why this happens. An example: if i delete the "S" in the "test" string it becomes "tEt". No idea why. Also it switches seemingly randomly between insert and non-insert mode, so i am never sure, what will happen if i press a key. I always install " mg" to be able to do basic text-editing tasks efficiently. Is "vi" really that bad, or am i doing something wrong? Why does it capitalize the characters?

Thats some weird behavior